Mark Zuckerberg's latest interview transcript: AR glasses will eventually replace smartphones

On September 26th, according to foreign media reports, Meta held its annual Meta Connect conference, announcing the latest developments in virtual reality, artificial intelligence, and the rapidly growing smart glasses field, including a new prototype of augmented reality glasses called Orion.

Subsequently, Zuckerberg was interviewed by Alex Heath, Deputy Editor of The Verge, revealing that Meta has spent $5 billion developing AR glasses and firmly believes that they will eventually replace smartphones.

Zuckerberg predicts that the seemingly ordinary Orion glasses can do two very basic things: integrate holographic images into the real world to create an unprecedented sense of reality, and serve as an excellent carrier for artificial intelligence.

Zuckerberg believes that there will be two coexisting forms of smart glasses in the market: holographic glasses pursuing the ultimate experience, and simple glasses focusing on cost-effectiveness and optimized for artificial intelligence experiences.

Below is an excerpt from the conversation between Alex Heath and Zuckerberg:

Smart Glasses as an Excellent Carrier for Artificial Intelligence

Q: It feels like true AR glasses are getting closer and closer to us. Has Orion been a product you have been developing for over five years? What were your thoughts when you first started researching it? What is its goal?

Zuckerberg: We have been developing Orion for nearly ten years, a journey that also reflects our relationship with the mobile platform. Although we originated from the web, not mobile, we witnessed the rise of smartphones and the parallel development of early social media platforms like Facebook. In this process, we did not play any role in the platform transformation. But we gradually realized that the rise of mobile devices as a computing platform, similar to the transition from desktop to mobile, heralded that this was by no means the end of computing development.

As the smartphone market became saturated, its definition and landscape had become relatively fixed between 2012 and 2014, and it was too late to shape this platform in a truly meaningful way. Therefore, I quickly changed my mindset: "We must look to the future because just as the transition from desktop to mobile devices foretold, a new wave of technology will emerge. So, what is the carrier of this wave?" The prototype in my mind is the Orion glasses that you are about to witness. These seemingly ordinary glasses do two very basic things.

First, it can integrate holographic images into the real world, creating an unprecedented sense of reality. Imagine sitting side by side with a friend from afar, or being in a foreign land, or even sharing a virtual ping-pong game with someone, this immersive experience will completely change our way of communication Next, it can be regarded as an excellent carrier for artificial intelligence. Its uniqueness lies in the fact that the glasses allow wearers to share visual and auditory experiences, achieving a sense of touch. Through subtle feedback mechanisms, it can whisper in your ear or display silent information on the lenses that only you can see, allowing users to immerse themselves in the virtual world while maintaining a keen perception of the real world. I firmly believe that this technology will have a profound impact.

As for its development path, I believe that in the initial stage, the realization of holographic images may precede the full integration of artificial intelligence. Before holographic technology achieves mass production at affordable prices, the integration of artificial intelligence has quietly become possible. This is where our vision lies. Considering that billions of people worldwide already need to wear glasses daily, its popularity is comparable to the early transformation of smartphones. I firmly believe that within the next decade, smart glasses will rapidly replace traditional glasses. As this trend deepens, the value of smart glasses becomes increasingly prominent, even attracting those who do not wear glasses to join in.

In view of this, we have launched a phased product: a smart glasses that integrates video transmission, content capture, cameras, microphones, and excellent audio experience in one, satisfying market demand in a more affordable form before holographic display technology matures. The core advantage of these glasses is the integration with Meta AI, equipped with multimodal interaction functions, including cameras, with an initial selling price of only $300.

Initially, we saw it as the foundation for developing holographic glasses technology. In the long run, we believe that two product forms will coexist in the market: holographic glasses pursuing the ultimate experience, and simple glasses focusing on cost-effectiveness and optimized for artificial intelligence experience. In addition, a series of products between the two are expected to emerge to meet the diverse needs of different consumers.

In addition, as another exploration direction, mixed reality headsets, although different in form from smart glasses, also carry the vision of achieving comprehensive computing and immersive experiences. We have defined our positioning: not blindly pursuing the traditional appearance of glasses, but focusing on integrating all computing functions into a product that is closer to a headset or goggles in form.

This will undoubtedly be a long battle, as countless people are eager to deeply immerse themselves in this new world. For those who work long hours at their desks, what they pursue is not only an improvement in work efficiency, but also a comprehensive innovation in computing experience. What Orion demonstrates is the future vision that I firmly believe in and continue to be optimistic about - a platform that is about to lead billions of people into a new computing era. With the rise of this platform, various supporting technologies and services will emerge like mushrooms after rain, collectively building a prosperous ecosystem around it.

Or Skip Developers and Release Directly to Consumers

Q: As far as I know, when you started developing Orion, you initially hoped it would be a product directly targeted at consumers Zuckerberg: Orion, as our first consumer product, its success remains unknown. Although the results may far exceed expectations, we are also acutely aware that not all set goals have been reached. We are eager for it to be smaller, brighter, with higher resolution, and more affordable. However, we plan to launch a second-generation product aimed at becoming a true consumer product. In this process, we will work with developers to continuously optimize the software experience using the Orion platform, ensuring that when the final product is launched, it can provide users with a more immersive and rich interactive experience.

Q: Companies like Apple and Snap have decided to first launch products for developers and involve developers in hardware development as early as possible. Do you intend to skip this step and directly launch products for consumers?

Zuckerberg: We will use early hardware as a development toolkit, mainly for internal use and may be shared with a few partners. Currently, Meta is a leader in the global augmented reality, virtual, and mixed reality fields, both in software and hardware. We see this as an integrated development toolkit, leveraging our deep internal talent pool and extensive external collaboration network to flexibly drive project progress.

We do not plan to widely release a set of development tools for all developers to purchase freely because we believe that through carefully selected partner relationships, we have sufficient professional expertise to gather the platform construction needs. Looking ahead in the next few years, we will focus on optimizing the gaming experience and delve into exploring the key elements of successful game releases.

Over $5 Billion Invested in Orion R&D

Q: There have been many speculations about your investments in Reality Labs. While you may not be able to provide an exact number, if we were to estimate the development cost of Orion over the past decade, would it be around $5 billion or more?

Zuckerberg: It is indeed possible to exceed this figure. For a while, many people thought that all our budgets would be used for VR and MR. But we have publicly stated that the budget scale of the smart glasses project actually surpasses that of the VR and MR projects, covering all projects, including full AR glasses, screenless glasses, all the work we will do on Ray-Ban glasses, and the expanded collaboration we just announced with Essilor Luxottica.

Expected to Essentially Replace Smartphones in Ten Years

Q: These glasses will not replace phones but will enhance the functions I use on my phone. I want to know if artificial intelligence applications are also places for this kind of interaction. Over time, how will these glasses become more closely linked with Meta AI? It seems that the relationship between them is becoming increasingly close Mark Zuckerberg: Over time, the integration of these glasses with Meta AI will become even closer, with artificial intelligence increasingly highlighting its core functions, providing users with unprecedented convenience and experience. You can do more things, such as reminders, or use simple voice commands like "call this phone number", and the glasses can respond instantly and complete the call.

We promise to continue introducing more innovative features in the future, including not only model upgrades, such as the introduction of Llama 3.2, but also deep development around the software ecosystem it builds. It is worth noting that the introduction of these value-added features is not simply dependent on model updates to automatically enjoy, but rather the unremitting efforts and continuous innovation of our team in the field of software development. We are committed to building a thriving ecosystem, allowing applications such as Spotify to be more native and seamlessly integrated into users' daily use.

So the glasses will become more and more useful, and I believe that over time, this will also increase demand. When discussing the interaction mode between glasses and mobile phones, a clear trend is that while the position of the mobile phone as the core computing platform is stable, glasses are gradually becoming the new favorite in our daily lives. However, I don't think people will quickly give up their phones. Just as when the phone became the main computing platform, we did not completely abandon the computer. I don't know if you have had this experience, but at some point in early 2010, when sitting at a desk in front of a computer, I would take out my phone to do some work on the computer.

This is not to say that we will give up our phones, but I think slowly, we will start to do more things with glasses and put our phones in our pockets more. Of course, this does not mean that computers or phones will quickly exit the stage of history, but that each will play its own role. In addition, with technological advancements, glasses are also expected to be powered by wearable devices on the wrist or other innovative ways, further enhancing their portability and battery life.

So, when you wake up one day in ten years, you may no longer need to carry a phone with you. While the phone will still exist in our lives, it will play more of a "backup" or "storage" role, being placed in pockets, bags, and even at home. Instead, glasses will gradually rise as the main medium for computing and interaction.

Will AI reduce human interaction?

Question: It's interesting to talk about this topic now because I feel that phones have become somewhat boring and outdated. I was just looking at the new iPhone and found that it has almost no changes from the previous year. Although people are trying foldable phones, it seems that there are not many innovative ideas about phones anymore, as if they have reached a natural endpoint. In comparison, when I see products like Ray-Ban and their appeal to people, it surprises me. I think this surprises all of us, perhaps because people now want to interact with technology in different ways, and Ray-Ban glasses are such a iconic product. I don't know if you agree with this.

Mark Zuckerberg: I agree. But I still think it's too early. We not only want to be able to ask artificial intelligence questions, but also want it to be able to perform tasks, and be able to reliably complete these tasks We are starting with simple functionalities now, such as voice control for glasses, which can also be done on phones, as well as reminder functions, which can also be achieved on phones. However, as the model's capabilities continue to enhance in the upcoming versions, gaining more of what people call "autonomous capabilities," this will become very exciting. Personally, I also believe that all artificial intelligence work will make phones more useful.

Question: Are you concerned that interacting with artificial intelligence will make people communicate less with others, thereby reducing human interaction?

Zuckerberg: From a sociological perspective, one phenomenon I have observed is that the actual social circles of most people are often much smaller than their expectations. People value genuine and profound interpersonal connections, and technology is key to enhancing this sense of connection and expanding social boundaries. Through innovative means, such as fun interactions, instant messaging, and holographic images displayed on smart glasses, we can cross geographical boundaries, making loved ones in distant places feel close and share warm moments as if they were nearby.

However, a somewhat poignant statistic shows that the average American often considers fewer than three friends to be truly intimate, far below the ten they might expect. This gap highlights the complexity and preciousness of interpersonal relationships. But technology, including innovative products like the glasses we are discussing, has the potential to bridge this gap. They not only provide more opportunities for people to seek support but also empower us with stronger capabilities to expand the breadth of our social networks while deepening emotional connections with family and friends.

Excessive regulation in the EU represents a step backward

Question: You have always been outspoken about the issue of artificial intelligence regulation in the EU. Currently, Meta AI is not available in Europe, and the new version of the Llama model cannot be used. Do you think this issue will be resolved? What conditions are needed to achieve this?

Zuckerberg: Analyzing European politics is quite challenging for me, especially when I have already endured the turmoil of American politics. However, I have some understanding of the basic operation of the European data protection framework: the implementation of the GDPR regulations aims to establish a one-stop national regulatory authority representing the entire EU to unify the interpretation and enforcement of data protection rules. Our company has headquarters in Europe and closely collaborates with this regulatory authority. While they have a tough stance, they have also helped us clarify communication directions and promote cooperation progress.

However, the issue lies in the fact that other data protection agencies on the European continent have recently started to intervene and attempt to take action, which seems to deviate from the initial intention of simplifying regulation, showing a backward trend. This appears more like a manifestation of internal EU political maneuvering, with debates focusing on whether to adhere to a one-stop service to provide clear guidance for businesses or to maintain the current complex regulatory system.

This undoubtedly poses a challenge for them internally. Multiple regulatory agencies repeatedly inquiring about the same matter undoubtedly add complexity and difficulty to building an innovative environment. I believe this is not an isolated case but a dilemma faced by many companies collectively.

I believe the future world will increasingly present a state of "half physical, half digital" — or perhaps 60% physical, 40% digital, and then the two mixed together. Around this point, there will be many interesting management issues, such as whether digital content overlaid on the physical world complies with the regulations of the physical state, or whether it actually comes from different domains or something else? These are all very interesting questions, and we will have our own perspective. I believe we cannot be right about everything. The world needs to figure out how it wants to land, different countries have different values and approaches. I think this is part of the interesting process.

Tencent Technology, original title: "Mark Zuckerberg's latest interview transcript: AR glasses will eventually replace smartphones"